German speaking category

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@Gleno0h said in German speaking category:

I do hope that German people that speak English would also keep posting in English. Keep seeing people that can speak English move to the German section though…

I agree.
I am skeptic about this, I have seen this on other boards I visit.
After some time people just stuck with their own kind.
I can understand the need but I’m not sure it’s a good idea,

But hey, thats just my 2 cents.

@Gleno0h You are so right, i really do not see this as a step forward for Pimatic or its support. The question from @leader21 a few posts above here probably indicates the need for a German speaking part in the forum (as the answer should be available in this forum, in English) , but dividing the forum will decrease the support and increase the double posting.
From now on questions and answers posted in German will be unavailable to me, limiting the sharing of knowledge of the Pimatic app…
What’s wrong with the google translate effort??

@ Gleno0h Du bist so richtig, ich sehe das nicht wirklich als einen Schritt vorwärts für Pimatic oder seine Unterstützung. Die Frage von @ leader21 ein paar Beiträge oben hier wahrscheinlich zeigt die Notwendigkeit für eine deutschsprachige Teil im Forum (wie die Antwort sollte in diesem Forum verfügbar sein, in Englisch), aber das Teilen der Forum wird die Unterstützung verringern und erhöhen die doppelte Posting .
Von nun an werden Fragen und Antworten, die auf Deutsch veröffentlicht werden, mir nicht zur Verfügung stehen, ** Begrenzung ** der ** Freigabe ** des Wissens der Pimatic App …
Was ist los mit dem Google Übersetzungsaufwand?

1. Edit/request: Will we be able to Exclude posts made in the German speaking part of the forum? I already see a lot of posts in German showing up in my “unread posts” view…
2. @noxx Please do not forget the effect of the input some other (non-German)users have given the development for the Pimatic app, making the forum available for German speaking people only would mean some of these people wouldn’t even have tried the app, skipping the input and/or development…

I totally agree with @Stokstaart and @Gleno0h. The chance an issue is solved decreases and we (persons that speak no or little German) won’t learn from other issues, or get new ideas upon posts from others.

I know about your fears and i hope that the german sub category won’t be “abused” by lazyness, if you understand

We are often having private requests via chat or email of users that are not speaking english and fear to ask something in the forum. therefore we made this step. it shall and will not replace the main forum. it should only be some kind of sub category for Q&A in German.
If we see that this category will fail due to lazyness of the users to use the main category we will close it. This category shall not divide our community!!
And also I know that some of our Dutch friends are speaking German or understand what is written in German. I/we appreciate that very much, also in the past! If you understand a German issue, feel free to answer in english!

So, das ganze nochmal in Deutsch! Wir wollen mit dieser Subkategorie NICHT die Bequemlichkeit fördern alles in Deutsch zu schreiben nur weil es diese Kategorie gibt.
Pimatic is ein internationales Projekt, daher ist die Forensprache nach wie vor Englisch, weil es eben die Weltsprache ist. Wäre Deutsch die Weltsprache Nummer eins, hätten wir jetzt keine Probleme

Wir als Team haben diese Kategorie ins Leben gerufen weil wir oftmals Hilferufe per Mail oder Chat erhalten von Usern ohne englisch Kenntnisse.

Wir bitten daher darum, dieses Forum nicht nur aus der Bequemlichkeit heraus zu verwenden sondern nur wenn es nicht anders geht! Sollten wir feststellen dass es hier in eine andere Richtung geht wie wir uns das gedacht haben, werden wir einen Schlußstrich unter das Projjekt Deutsch setzen und das Forum wieder schließen!
Dieses Forum soll unsere Community nicht spalten sondern Sprachbarrieren überbrücken.

“We are often having private requests via chat or email of users that are not speaking english and fear to ask something in the forum. therefore we made this step.”
By making these conversations you have created the need for the German sub forum. If you pointed out that one could easily use Google translate for posting a question you would keep the English language and keep sharing the knowledge.

“it shall and will not replace the main forum.”
I certainly hope so, although some users are already requesting this (If my German readingskills are not lying to me)

“And also I know that some of our Dutch friends are speaking German or understand what is written in German”.
I can only speak for myself, but i think for the majority of the Dutch users English is a better way to go. Also for the English only speaking members of the forum.

“If you understand a German issue, feel free to answer in english!”.
Nothing personal but i really do not see myself straining myself to understand the question posted in German with no English translation. When someone posts something on the forum i would expect them to have made some effort to solve the issue by themselves, for me this includes searching the forum and in the end at least use Google translate to provide a English post.

I know my English is far from perfect, but you’ll love it once you see me type something in German.

@Stokstaart said in German speaking category:

I know my English is far from perfect, but you’ll love it once you see me type something in German.

well, neither do i in dutch
don’t worry to hard.
let’s see where it leads to

@leader21 indeed. It is just released so we have to see where this goes. I am Dutch and my mother used to watch German channels, and everything, i mean everything gets dubbed to German, so yeah, i can understand that not everyone can speak/type English. It is just like @Stokstaart said, i dont even bother to read it because i will probably read things wrong and so i wont bother to answer.

As i said, i can understand but i hope this wont be a step backwards

I agree with most of the non-German repliers
My English is far from perfect, but compared to my German it’s flawles and that’s just normal German, not the tech part of the language.
To give a rough idea : I’m literally abondend from helping my daughter with German schoolwork

Hopefully we’ll be able to use a babelfish one day

Eventhough the big companies are celebrating the great advances in AI**, online translation is still poor. It can be a great tool for the average speaker who is able to fix obvious errors and false context translations. Users who are not familiar with the language will be basically lost in translation.

** perhaps AI is more of a “hype” thing which occurs like every 15 years.

Translated with Google Translate:

Hoffentlich werden wir in der Lage sein, ein babelfish eines Tages zu benutzen

Obwohl die großen Unternehmen die großen Fortschritte in AI ** feiern, ist die Online-Übersetzung immer noch schlecht. Es kann ein großartiges Werkzeug für den durchschnittlichen Sprecher sein, der in der Lage ist, offensichtliche Fehler und falsche Kontextübersetzungen zu beheben. Benutzer, die mit der Sprache nicht vertraut sind, werden grundsätzlich in der Übersetzung verloren.

vielleicht ist AI eher ein “Hype” Ding, das wie alle 15 Jahre auftritt.

^^ not too bad at all

For me, i will request the most of my questions in english - sometimes it is hard to find the right words. of course, i can use the google translation - but then i feel me like a dumbass.

its the same if you talk with your Nederlands guys in (what is the name of the laguage in english?) Niederländisch.

I try to speak english…

I´m german and would like to know who i´m talking.
So a feature like a small flag or a Letter would be helpful to know wich Language my opposite speaks naturally.
So i can ask in german language if its to difficult in english.

But i will keep posting in english…
Gruß M.

@Michael-Rudek by speaking English you talk to a wider group of people and thus resulting in faster problem solving. If we are going to make threads where it starts in English, to German, to Dutch and then Chinese, it would be hard for people to know what exactly is going on. This is why there is a German section. I would like to recommend to throw your question through a translate app and post that under the German words, this way, anyone speaking English that can fix your problem, can respond too. I believe that was kinda what @leader21 wanted to achive with this new sub forum…

@schmucke it is Dutch

Using a DIY smart home system I imagine people need to look into other technical topics as well… Most of documentation, blogs and forums are in English. So I guess it is wise to speak at least a little bit of English (in general!)
I as a German don’t like this sub section, which will lead to all questions into one sub and split the community even more.

But I guess people asking for a German sub forum is just a very German thing to do - Why go the extra mile if you are “the majority of people” as @noxx puts it…

I am confident people can use Google Translate to understand mostly everything and use it to ask further questions or ask one of their fellow Germans to translate / help further. If the language keeps you from doing something, maybe other missing skills will, too?

Let’s see how this works out. I will keep writing everything in english as I also search/google for anything in english first as most literature/activity in this area is english.

I have respect for everybody getting into DIY electronics/software without solid knowledge of english as it must be very difficult. I can only suggest to use something like google translate or online courses like duolingo to learn english as it opens a whole new world of information.

As far as I can see most of the questions asked in the German category could have easily been asked in the english languange. Maybe with a little bit of effort. For me it is no problem reading them, but it will make searching within the forum very difficult. So I would say take some effort, translate into english and if you can not find the right word or sentence write it in German. Maybe we should start a Dutch section as well, as many users are Dutch…

So now we see automatically the point why the Dutch are better (besides footbal) than the German…

@dynamite We should not want anymore sub forums. Dutch people can manage English, also the technical questions. We(Dutch) are mostly raised around English movies, music etc. This cant be said for the Germans. As @leader21 is imo a good moderator, we should not be concerned as to where this leads. I cant imagine that this great community would go full-German, so dont worry, beeeee happy

@Gleno0h the Dutch forum was basically ironically said… so no worries

So after 4 months I noticed more and more German topics when I click on the unread button.

At first I actually tried to understand the questions and even used google to see what a topic was about but I don’t anymore.
I still feel if someone wants help he/she could make some effort and post in English.
I am still afraid knowledge is getting lost this way.

What’s everyone’s thought about this?

PS this is my perspective

I agree, more and more German topics that are getting more technical. Even a perfectly fine English topic was switched to German: https://forum.pimatic.org/topic/3323/apply-string-expressions

In my opinion a lot of tips, info and solutions are not reaching everyone because it’s all in German. And to be complete honest : I refuse to read any German topic. I simply do not master German enough to understand a technical German topic.